Whenever I post anything about anthropogenic climate change, I get "What about China?" comments. It is true that the U.S. has actually reduced its carbon emissions slightly in recent years, and that China has now surpassed the U.S. in annual emissions. But we're still the #2 emitter in the world. Growing emissions from India are also a problem. Note that because the U.S. was the #1 emitter for most of the industrial age, we're still far an away responsible for the largest cumulative amount of anthropogenic CO2 in the atmosphere.
Here's the story for the whole planet right now.
So yes, if we want to solve this problem we're going to need China, India and the EU to get serious about it, as well as the U.S., and obviously the rest of the world also matters. China is the world's largest manufacturer of photovoltaics, but they've built their industrial economy on coal and they're still dependent on it. So what can the U.S. do about China?
The Chinese leadership certainly says that they take the problem seriously and they intend to address it. I have to assume that's true but they haven't been able to make the transition so far. So we need to collaborate with them in trade and technology. We need to buy their photovoltaics and other green technology, to encourage those industries in China as well as use the products ourselves. We are more technologically innovative and we need to share technology with the rest of the world. A hostile relationship with China, trade barriers, and technology embargoes, are the worst possible scenario.
The only way to solve a global crisis is as a global community. No, we can't fix the inside of Xi Jinping's head, but we need to find ways to work with him.
11 comments:
Yeah, well, calling Xi a dictator ain't helping much.
Cervantes,
According to the UN, the United States is leading the world on reducing it's output of carbon. It's not 'slightly'. So much so that UN says they've exceeded the goals set forth in the Paris Accord and there's no need for US to be a part of it.
What's NOT being told is China's FUTURE plans to greatly expand the use of coal, both in China and in other countries.
China has no incentive, nor plans, to curtail its plans to expand the use of coal in the future.
Nada
Looks like China, that one country, emits about THREE TIMES as much carbon as the US.There is no comparison.
And what are their plans for the future? It's my understanding that they have no responsibility to make any reductions for 10 years as part of the Paris Accord.
Who's the brainiac that negotiated that deal?
What about Liechtenstein?
Since India and China each have about 4 times the population of the US, wouldn't it be more useful to look at carbon footprint per capita?
@Chucky
Reducing carbon is the goal, not 'splaining 'fairness.
US is doing that. China and India are not.
IB:
Could it be that for the 200 years following the American Revolution, while the US as one of the richest nations on earth was busy raping the environment in any way that would turn a buck, desperately poor China was busy not starving? During the last 50 years they've made phenomenal strides catching up - a testament to the cultural bones of one of the world's great civilizations; one that is at least 10 times as old as the US.
We have no grounds to complain about their affect on the environment until our carbon footprint per person matches theirs.
Truman:
Agreed. But what metric do you use to assess progress? Yours makes Liechtenstein look pretty awesome. Could it be that per capita makes us feel "uncomfortable" about ourselves?
Chucky:
Please review the data provided by Cervantes.
Not sure how anyone could not conclude that China and India are NOT reducing carbon output, even measuring by per capita.
What am I missing here?
Chucky:
See:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/29/china-wind-solar-power-global-renewable-energy-leader
From TheGuardian article"
The Kela plant is located in the sparsely populated west of the country, where more than three-quarters of coal, wind and solar power is generated. But the vast majority of energy consumption happens in the east. Transporting energy thousands of miles across the country results in inefficiencies.
The way China’s grid is organised can incentivise building coal plants around renewable generators. Much of the new renewable capacity is not connected to the local energy supply and often bundled with coal power to be transmitted to areas of higher demand.
More coal power was approved in the first three months of 2023 than in the whole of 2021.
Also from TheGuardian:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/apr/24/china-ramps-up-coal-power-despite-carbon-neutral-pledges
"Local governments in China approved more new coal power in the first three months of 2023 than in the whole of 2021, according to official documents.
The approvals, analysed by Greenpeace, reveal that between January and March this year, at least 20.45 gigawatts of coal power was approved, up from 8.63GW in the same period in 2022. In the whole of 2021, 18GW of coal was approved."
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